Pieter Wuille [ARCHIVE] on Nostr: đź“… Original date posted:2015-08-04 đź“ť Original message:I would like to withdraw ...
đź“… Original date posted:2015-08-04
đź“ť Original message:I would like to withdraw my proposal from your self-appointed vote.
If you want to let a majority decide about economic policy of a currency, I
suggest fiat currencies. They have been using this approach for quite a
while, I hear.
Bitcoin's consensus rules are a consensus system, not a democracy. Find a
solution that everyone agrees on, or don't.
On Aug 4, 2015 9:51 AM, "jl2012 via bitcoin-dev" <
bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> As now we have some concrete proposals (
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-July/009808.html),
> I think we should wrap up the endless debate with voting by different
> stakeholder groups.
>
> ---------------------------------
> Candidate proposals
>
> Candidate proposals must be complete BIPs with reference implementation
> which are ready to merge immediately. They must first go through the usual
> peer review process and get approved by the developers in a technical
> standpoint, without political or philosophical considerations. Any fine
> tune of a candidate proposal may not become an independent candidate,
> unless it introduces some “real” difference. “No change” is also one of the
> voting options.
> ---------------------------------
> Voter groups
>
> There will be several voter groups and their votes will be counted
> independently. (The time frames mentioned below are just for example.)
>
> Miners: miners of blocks with timestamp between 1 to 30 Sept 2015 are
> eligible to vote. One block one vote. Miners will cast their votes by
> signing with the bitcoin address in coinbase. If there are multiple
> coinbase outputs, the vote is discounted by output value / total coinbase
> output value.
> Many well-known pools are reusing addresses and they may not need to
> digitally sign their votes. In case there is any dispute, the digitally
> signed vote will be counted.
>
> Bitcoin holders: People with bitcoin in the UTXO at block 372500 (around
> early September) are eligible to vote. The total “balance” of each
> scriptPubKey is calculated and this is the weight of the vote. People will
> cast their votes by digital signature.
> Special output types:
> Multi-sig: vote must be signed according to the setting of the multi-sig.
> P2SH: the serialized script must be provided
> Publicly known private key: not eligible to vote
> Non-standard script according to latest Bitcoin Core rules: not eligible
> to vote in general. May be judged case-by-case
>
> Developers: People with certain amount of contribution in the past year in
> Bitcoin Core or other open sources wallet / alternative implementations.
> One person one vote.
>
> Exchanges: Centralized exchanges listed on Coindesk Bitcoin Index,
> Winkdex, or NYSE Bitcoin index, with 30 days volume >100,000BTC are
> invited. This includes Bitfinex, BTC China, BitStamp, BTC-E, itBit, OKCoin,
> Huobi, Coinbase. Exchanges operated for at least 1 year with 100,000BTC
> 30-day volume may also apply to be a voter in this category. One exchange
> one vote.
>
> Merchants and service providers: This category includes all bitcoin
> accepting business that is not centralized fiat-currency exchange, e.g.
> virtual or physical stores, gambling sites, online wallet service, payment
> processors like Bitpay, decentralized exchange like Localbitcoin, ETF
> operators like Secondmarket Bitcoin Investment Trust. They must directly
> process bitcoin without relying on third party. They should process at
> least 100BTC in the last 30-days. One merchant one vote.
>
> Full nodes operators: People operating full nodes for at least 168 hours
> (1 week) in July 2015 are eligible to vote, determined by the log of
> Bitnodes. Time is set in the past to avoid manipulation. One IP address one
> vote. Vote must be sent from the node’s IP address.
>
> --------------------
> Voting system
>
> Single transferable vote is applied. (
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote). Voters are
> required to rank their preference with “1”, “2”, “3”, etc, or use “N” to
> indicate rejection of a candidate.
> Vote counting starts with every voter’s first choice. The candidate with
> fewest votes is eliminated and those votes are transferred according to
> their second choice. This process repeats until only one candidate is left,
> which is the most popular candidate. The result is presented as the
> approval rate: final votes for the most popular candidate / all valid votes
>
> After the most popular candidate is determined, the whole counting process
> is repeated by eliminating this candidate, which will find the approval
> rate for the second most popular candidate. The process repeats until all
> proposals are ranked with the approval rate calculated.
>
> --------------------
> Interpretation of results:
>
> It is possible that a candidate with lower ranking to have higher approval
> rate. However, ranking is more important than the approval rate, unless the
> difference in approval rate is really huge. 90% support would be excellent;
> 70% is good; 50% is marginal; <50% is failed.
>
> --------------------
> Technical issues:
>
> Voting by the miners, developers, exchanges, and merchants are probably
> the easiest. We need a trusted person to verify the voters’ identity by
> email, website, or digital signature. The trusted person will collect votes
> and publish the named votes so anyone could verify the results.
>
> For full nodes, we need a trusted person to setup a website as an
> interface to vote. The votes with IP address will be published.
>
> For bitcoin holders, the workload could be very high and we may need some
> automatic system to collect and count the votes. If people are worrying
> about reduced security due to exposed raw public key, they should move
> their bitcoin to a new address before voting.
>
> Double voting: people are generally not allowed to change their mind after
> voting, especially for anonymous voters like bitcoin holders and solo
> miners. A double voting attempt from these classes will invalidate all
> related votes.
>
> Multiple identity: People may have multiple roles in the Bitcoin ecology.
> I believe they should be allowed to vote in all applicable categories since
> they are contributing more than other people.
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
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đź“ť Original message:I would like to withdraw my proposal from your self-appointed vote.
If you want to let a majority decide about economic policy of a currency, I
suggest fiat currencies. They have been using this approach for quite a
while, I hear.
Bitcoin's consensus rules are a consensus system, not a democracy. Find a
solution that everyone agrees on, or don't.
On Aug 4, 2015 9:51 AM, "jl2012 via bitcoin-dev" <
bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote:
> As now we have some concrete proposals (
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-July/009808.html),
> I think we should wrap up the endless debate with voting by different
> stakeholder groups.
>
> ---------------------------------
> Candidate proposals
>
> Candidate proposals must be complete BIPs with reference implementation
> which are ready to merge immediately. They must first go through the usual
> peer review process and get approved by the developers in a technical
> standpoint, without political or philosophical considerations. Any fine
> tune of a candidate proposal may not become an independent candidate,
> unless it introduces some “real” difference. “No change” is also one of the
> voting options.
> ---------------------------------
> Voter groups
>
> There will be several voter groups and their votes will be counted
> independently. (The time frames mentioned below are just for example.)
>
> Miners: miners of blocks with timestamp between 1 to 30 Sept 2015 are
> eligible to vote. One block one vote. Miners will cast their votes by
> signing with the bitcoin address in coinbase. If there are multiple
> coinbase outputs, the vote is discounted by output value / total coinbase
> output value.
> Many well-known pools are reusing addresses and they may not need to
> digitally sign their votes. In case there is any dispute, the digitally
> signed vote will be counted.
>
> Bitcoin holders: People with bitcoin in the UTXO at block 372500 (around
> early September) are eligible to vote. The total “balance” of each
> scriptPubKey is calculated and this is the weight of the vote. People will
> cast their votes by digital signature.
> Special output types:
> Multi-sig: vote must be signed according to the setting of the multi-sig.
> P2SH: the serialized script must be provided
> Publicly known private key: not eligible to vote
> Non-standard script according to latest Bitcoin Core rules: not eligible
> to vote in general. May be judged case-by-case
>
> Developers: People with certain amount of contribution in the past year in
> Bitcoin Core or other open sources wallet / alternative implementations.
> One person one vote.
>
> Exchanges: Centralized exchanges listed on Coindesk Bitcoin Index,
> Winkdex, or NYSE Bitcoin index, with 30 days volume >100,000BTC are
> invited. This includes Bitfinex, BTC China, BitStamp, BTC-E, itBit, OKCoin,
> Huobi, Coinbase. Exchanges operated for at least 1 year with 100,000BTC
> 30-day volume may also apply to be a voter in this category. One exchange
> one vote.
>
> Merchants and service providers: This category includes all bitcoin
> accepting business that is not centralized fiat-currency exchange, e.g.
> virtual or physical stores, gambling sites, online wallet service, payment
> processors like Bitpay, decentralized exchange like Localbitcoin, ETF
> operators like Secondmarket Bitcoin Investment Trust. They must directly
> process bitcoin without relying on third party. They should process at
> least 100BTC in the last 30-days. One merchant one vote.
>
> Full nodes operators: People operating full nodes for at least 168 hours
> (1 week) in July 2015 are eligible to vote, determined by the log of
> Bitnodes. Time is set in the past to avoid manipulation. One IP address one
> vote. Vote must be sent from the node’s IP address.
>
> --------------------
> Voting system
>
> Single transferable vote is applied. (
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote). Voters are
> required to rank their preference with “1”, “2”, “3”, etc, or use “N” to
> indicate rejection of a candidate.
> Vote counting starts with every voter’s first choice. The candidate with
> fewest votes is eliminated and those votes are transferred according to
> their second choice. This process repeats until only one candidate is left,
> which is the most popular candidate. The result is presented as the
> approval rate: final votes for the most popular candidate / all valid votes
>
> After the most popular candidate is determined, the whole counting process
> is repeated by eliminating this candidate, which will find the approval
> rate for the second most popular candidate. The process repeats until all
> proposals are ranked with the approval rate calculated.
>
> --------------------
> Interpretation of results:
>
> It is possible that a candidate with lower ranking to have higher approval
> rate. However, ranking is more important than the approval rate, unless the
> difference in approval rate is really huge. 90% support would be excellent;
> 70% is good; 50% is marginal; <50% is failed.
>
> --------------------
> Technical issues:
>
> Voting by the miners, developers, exchanges, and merchants are probably
> the easiest. We need a trusted person to verify the voters’ identity by
> email, website, or digital signature. The trusted person will collect votes
> and publish the named votes so anyone could verify the results.
>
> For full nodes, we need a trusted person to setup a website as an
> interface to vote. The votes with IP address will be published.
>
> For bitcoin holders, the workload could be very high and we may need some
> automatic system to collect and count the votes. If people are worrying
> about reduced security due to exposed raw public key, they should move
> their bitcoin to a new address before voting.
>
> Double voting: people are generally not allowed to change their mind after
> voting, especially for anonymous voters like bitcoin holders and solo
> miners. A double voting attempt from these classes will invalidate all
> related votes.
>
> Multiple identity: People may have multiple roles in the Bitcoin ecology.
> I believe they should be allowed to vote in all applicable categories since
> they are contributing more than other people.
>
> _______________________________________________
> bitcoin-dev mailing list
> bitcoin-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/bitcoin-dev
>
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