quangobaud on Nostr: nprofile1q…ghz70 (phone just decided that scroll-up meant close screen and delete ...
nprofile1qy2hwumn8ghj7un9d3shjtnddaehgu3wwp6kyqpqtxm993vcqstl0aratjhnl2hxqr8q2vc5shfk59qmedwhexxv2qpq4ghz70 (nprofile…hz70)
(phone just decided that scroll-up meant close screen and delete draft - phone has had an update in the background which has introduced some buggy user interface)
We don't get the word "Moor" in reference to muslim people till the rise of "English" about the C11th.
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(Google/Wikipedia)
"The English Morocco is an anglicisation of the Spanish name for the country, Marruecos, derived from the name of the city of Marrakesh, which was the capital of the Almoravid dynasty, the Almohad Caliphate, and the Saadian dynasty"
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I can't quite recall the major thing that I read on Moroccan history but I think it was about libraries, trade & money/banking before the C10th but after the spread of Islam during the C8th & C9th.
I've not read the story of Don Rodrigo Diaz de Vivar of Castellon (el Cid) but I'm sure the terminology in that era in Spain for arabic people and muslims in particular was not "Moor". By the C16th, you get common english usage of "moor" and "blackamoor" which fits with the C11th rise of the Almoravid's in Morocco. Contemporary Spanish has "moro/mora".
From too much Crusader history being flung at me, I assume around the C10th the actual word used by europeans for muslim soldiers may have been some form of the word "Saracen".
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Here's what Google's AI Overview (😱) says :-
The word "Saracen" has multiple possible origins, including:
Greek: The word "Saracen" comes from the Greek word sarakenoi. In the early Roman Empire, the term was used to describe an Arab tribe in the Sinai. Later, the Greek-speaking subjects of the Empire used the term to refer to all Arabs.
Arabic: The word "Saracen" may come from the Arabic verb saraqa, which means "to steal". It may also come from the Arabic words sharq and sharqi, which mean "east" and "easterner".
Place-name: The name may come from the place-name Saraka or SarakaE, which refers to the tribe camping in the area. However, there is no Arabic reference to either the place or the tribe.
Desert: The name may come from the Arabic word sahara, which means "desert".
Partner: The name may come from the Arabic word shanik, which means "partner".
The term "Saracen" spread into western Europe through the Byzantines and the crusaders.
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I like the idea that "Sahara" became "Saracen" as I've known much less likely name origins. I wonder what Reddit ...
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One theory says it is derogatory in nature. It basically suggests that Saracen comes from the Arabic سارقين/sariqeen meaning thieves.
- - -
... Cheezus, Reddit.
Anyway, C4th christian bishop Nicholas is far too early to be called a "moor" and I'm having no luck finding a contemporary term for muslim soldiers (occupiers) during the Umayyad rule in Spain.
To find out what terms were being used for "moroccans" during his time requires me to do more digging, though I'm inclined to believe it is irrelevant as the origins of St Nick usually say he is "Turkish" under then Roman rule.
(phone just decided that scroll-up meant close screen and delete draft - phone has had an update in the background which has introduced some buggy user interface)
We don't get the word "Moor" in reference to muslim people till the rise of "English" about the C11th.
- - -
(Google/Wikipedia)
"The English Morocco is an anglicisation of the Spanish name for the country, Marruecos, derived from the name of the city of Marrakesh, which was the capital of the Almoravid dynasty, the Almohad Caliphate, and the Saadian dynasty"
- - -
I can't quite recall the major thing that I read on Moroccan history but I think it was about libraries, trade & money/banking before the C10th but after the spread of Islam during the C8th & C9th.
I've not read the story of Don Rodrigo Diaz de Vivar of Castellon (el Cid) but I'm sure the terminology in that era in Spain for arabic people and muslims in particular was not "Moor". By the C16th, you get common english usage of "moor" and "blackamoor" which fits with the C11th rise of the Almoravid's in Morocco. Contemporary Spanish has "moro/mora".
From too much Crusader history being flung at me, I assume around the C10th the actual word used by europeans for muslim soldiers may have been some form of the word "Saracen".
- - -
Here's what Google's AI Overview (😱) says :-
The word "Saracen" has multiple possible origins, including:
Greek: The word "Saracen" comes from the Greek word sarakenoi. In the early Roman Empire, the term was used to describe an Arab tribe in the Sinai. Later, the Greek-speaking subjects of the Empire used the term to refer to all Arabs.
Arabic: The word "Saracen" may come from the Arabic verb saraqa, which means "to steal". It may also come from the Arabic words sharq and sharqi, which mean "east" and "easterner".
Place-name: The name may come from the place-name Saraka or SarakaE, which refers to the tribe camping in the area. However, there is no Arabic reference to either the place or the tribe.
Desert: The name may come from the Arabic word sahara, which means "desert".
Partner: The name may come from the Arabic word shanik, which means "partner".
The term "Saracen" spread into western Europe through the Byzantines and the crusaders.
- - -
I like the idea that "Sahara" became "Saracen" as I've known much less likely name origins. I wonder what Reddit ...
- - -
One theory says it is derogatory in nature. It basically suggests that Saracen comes from the Arabic سارقين/sariqeen meaning thieves.
- - -
... Cheezus, Reddit.
Anyway, C4th christian bishop Nicholas is far too early to be called a "moor" and I'm having no luck finding a contemporary term for muslim soldiers (occupiers) during the Umayyad rule in Spain.
To find out what terms were being used for "moroccans" during his time requires me to do more digging, though I'm inclined to believe it is irrelevant as the origins of St Nick usually say he is "Turkish" under then Roman rule.