Denis Gorbachev [ARCHIVE] on Nostr: 📅 Original date posted:2015-12-16 📝 Original message: Rusty, Mark - thanks for ...
📅 Original date posted:2015-12-16
📝 Original message:
Rusty, Mark - thanks for the explanations!
On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 10:49 AM Mark Friedenbach <mark at friedenbach.org>
wrote:
> It should be noted that this estimation is biasing towards
> worst-case-latency/best-case-decentralization. Even though we will make
> conscious efforts to keep lightning networks as decentralized as possible,
> it is still the case that we will see some centralization pressure due to
> the desire for low latency transactions. I expect that the average user's
> experience of a 10-hop payment would be on the order of 1-2 seconds, with
> the inner-hops being between Tier-1 datacenter nodes primarily with payment
> channels chosen based on network proximity. A 'near' payment to someone
> closer to them would be under a second. But it is very good to know that a
> network consisting entirely of last-mile endpoints geographically
> distributed around the world would only have a worst-case transaction time
> of only about 10s or so. Even that is doable for PoS.
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 8:04 AM, Rusty Russell <rusty at rustcorp.com.au>
> wrote:
>
>> Denis Gorbachev <denis.d.gorbachev at gmail.com> writes:
>> > Assuming a simple case of "Consumer - Relay - Provider" (2 hops), how
>> long
>> > should it take for provider to receive the payment?
>>
>> Assuming established channels already (assuming CPU is instant, so we're
>> just paying for network latency):
>>
>> Consumer offers Relay a contract:
>> C -> R: update_add_htlc
>> R -> C: update_accept
>> C -> R: update_signature
>> R -> C: update_complete*
>>
>> Relay offers Provider a contract:
>> R -> P: update_add_htlc
>> P -> R: update_accept
>> R -> P: update_signature
>> P -> R: update_complete*
>>
>> Provider closes contract with relay:
>> P -> R: update_fulfill_htlc
>> R -> P: update_accept
>> P -> R: update_signature
>> R -> P: update_complete*
>>
>> Relay closes contract with Client:
>> R -> C: update_fulfill_htlc
>> C -> R: update_accept
>> R -> C: update_signature
>> C -> R: update_complete*
>>
>> You don't need to wait for the update_complete packets to arrive, so
>> that works out to 3 RTTs per hop. You might expect up to 10 hops in a
>> large lightning network, so 30 RTTs.
>>
>> I'm in Australia, and my bitcoin node latency averages 330ms (ouch!).
>> So that would be 10 seconds.
>>
>> Hope that helps!
>> Rusty.
>>
> _______________________________________________
>> Lightning-dev mailing list
>> Lightning-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lightning-dev
>>
> --
@DenGorbachev <https://twitter.com/DenGorbachev>;
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/lightning-dev/attachments/20151216/b011de47/attachment-0001.html>;
📝 Original message:
Rusty, Mark - thanks for the explanations!
On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 10:49 AM Mark Friedenbach <mark at friedenbach.org>
wrote:
> It should be noted that this estimation is biasing towards
> worst-case-latency/best-case-decentralization. Even though we will make
> conscious efforts to keep lightning networks as decentralized as possible,
> it is still the case that we will see some centralization pressure due to
> the desire for low latency transactions. I expect that the average user's
> experience of a 10-hop payment would be on the order of 1-2 seconds, with
> the inner-hops being between Tier-1 datacenter nodes primarily with payment
> channels chosen based on network proximity. A 'near' payment to someone
> closer to them would be under a second. But it is very good to know that a
> network consisting entirely of last-mile endpoints geographically
> distributed around the world would only have a worst-case transaction time
> of only about 10s or so. Even that is doable for PoS.
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 8:04 AM, Rusty Russell <rusty at rustcorp.com.au>
> wrote:
>
>> Denis Gorbachev <denis.d.gorbachev at gmail.com> writes:
>> > Assuming a simple case of "Consumer - Relay - Provider" (2 hops), how
>> long
>> > should it take for provider to receive the payment?
>>
>> Assuming established channels already (assuming CPU is instant, so we're
>> just paying for network latency):
>>
>> Consumer offers Relay a contract:
>> C -> R: update_add_htlc
>> R -> C: update_accept
>> C -> R: update_signature
>> R -> C: update_complete*
>>
>> Relay offers Provider a contract:
>> R -> P: update_add_htlc
>> P -> R: update_accept
>> R -> P: update_signature
>> P -> R: update_complete*
>>
>> Provider closes contract with relay:
>> P -> R: update_fulfill_htlc
>> R -> P: update_accept
>> P -> R: update_signature
>> R -> P: update_complete*
>>
>> Relay closes contract with Client:
>> R -> C: update_fulfill_htlc
>> C -> R: update_accept
>> R -> C: update_signature
>> C -> R: update_complete*
>>
>> You don't need to wait for the update_complete packets to arrive, so
>> that works out to 3 RTTs per hop. You might expect up to 10 hops in a
>> large lightning network, so 30 RTTs.
>>
>> I'm in Australia, and my bitcoin node latency averages 330ms (ouch!).
>> So that would be 10 seconds.
>>
>> Hope that helps!
>> Rusty.
>>
> _______________________________________________
>> Lightning-dev mailing list
>> Lightning-dev at lists.linuxfoundation.org
>> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lightning-dev
>>
> --
@DenGorbachev <https://twitter.com/DenGorbachev>;
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/lightning-dev/attachments/20151216/b011de47/attachment-0001.html>;