Tamas Blummer [ARCHIVE] on Nostr: 📅 Original date posted:2014-03-29 📝 Original message:This is why my motivation ...
📅 Original date posted:2014-03-29
📝 Original message:This is why my motivation is rather secure backup, not multisig. Instead of storing encrypted seed in one location and the passphrase for it in an other location, one can just store two shares in two places.
> Right - the explanation in the BIP about the board of directors is IMO a little misleading. The problem is with splitting a private key is that at some point, someone has to get the full private key back and they can then just remember the private key to undo the system. CHECKMULTISIG avoids this.
>
> I can imagine that there may be occasional uses for splitting a wallet seed like this, like for higher security cold wallets, but I suspect an ongoing shared account like a corporate account is still best off using CHECKMULTISIG or the n-of-m ECDSA threshold scheme proposed by Ali et al.
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 2:27 PM, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik at bitpay.com> wrote:
> The comparison with multisig fails to mention that multi-signature
> transactions explicitly define security at the transaction level.
> This permits fine-grained specificity of what a key holder may
> approve.
>
> Shamir is much more coarse-grained. You reconstitute a private key,
> which may then be used to control anything that key controls. Thus,
> in addition to Shamir itself, you need policies such as "no key
> reuse."
>
> My first impression of Shamir many moons ago was "cool!" but that's
> since been tempered by thinking through the use cases. Shamir has a
> higher D.I.Y. factor, with a correspondingly larger surface of
> things-that-could-go-wrong, IMO.
>
> (None of this implies making an informational BIP lacks value; I'm all
> for an informational BIP)
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 7:54 AM, Chris Beams <chris at beams.io> wrote:
> > Enlightening; thanks, Matt. And apologies to the list for my earlier inadvertent double-post.
> >
> > On Mar 29, 2014, at 12:16 PM, Matt Whitlock <bip at mattwhitlock.name> wrote:
> >
> >> On Saturday, 29 March 2014, at 10:08 am, Chris Beams wrote:
> >>> Matt, could you expand on use cases for which you see Shamir's Secret Sharing Scheme as the best tool for the job? In particular, when do you see that it would be superior to simply going with multisig in the first place? Perhaps you see these as complimentary approaches, toward defense-in-depth? In any case, the Motivation and Rationale sections of the BIP in its current form are silent on these questions.
> >>
> >> I have added two new sections to address your questions.
> >>
> >> https://github.com/whitslack/btctool/blob/bip/bip-xxxx.mediawiki
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Bitcoin-development mailing list
> > Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Jeff Garzik
> Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist
> BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
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📝 Original message:This is why my motivation is rather secure backup, not multisig. Instead of storing encrypted seed in one location and the passphrase for it in an other location, one can just store two shares in two places.
> Right - the explanation in the BIP about the board of directors is IMO a little misleading. The problem is with splitting a private key is that at some point, someone has to get the full private key back and they can then just remember the private key to undo the system. CHECKMULTISIG avoids this.
>
> I can imagine that there may be occasional uses for splitting a wallet seed like this, like for higher security cold wallets, but I suspect an ongoing shared account like a corporate account is still best off using CHECKMULTISIG or the n-of-m ECDSA threshold scheme proposed by Ali et al.
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 2:27 PM, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik at bitpay.com> wrote:
> The comparison with multisig fails to mention that multi-signature
> transactions explicitly define security at the transaction level.
> This permits fine-grained specificity of what a key holder may
> approve.
>
> Shamir is much more coarse-grained. You reconstitute a private key,
> which may then be used to control anything that key controls. Thus,
> in addition to Shamir itself, you need policies such as "no key
> reuse."
>
> My first impression of Shamir many moons ago was "cool!" but that's
> since been tempered by thinking through the use cases. Shamir has a
> higher D.I.Y. factor, with a correspondingly larger surface of
> things-that-could-go-wrong, IMO.
>
> (None of this implies making an informational BIP lacks value; I'm all
> for an informational BIP)
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 7:54 AM, Chris Beams <chris at beams.io> wrote:
> > Enlightening; thanks, Matt. And apologies to the list for my earlier inadvertent double-post.
> >
> > On Mar 29, 2014, at 12:16 PM, Matt Whitlock <bip at mattwhitlock.name> wrote:
> >
> >> On Saturday, 29 March 2014, at 10:08 am, Chris Beams wrote:
> >>> Matt, could you expand on use cases for which you see Shamir's Secret Sharing Scheme as the best tool for the job? In particular, when do you see that it would be superior to simply going with multisig in the first place? Perhaps you see these as complimentary approaches, toward defense-in-depth? In any case, the Motivation and Rationale sections of the BIP in its current form are silent on these questions.
> >>
> >> I have added two new sections to address your questions.
> >>
> >> https://github.com/whitslack/btctool/blob/bip/bip-xxxx.mediawiki
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Bitcoin-development mailing list
> > Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Jeff Garzik
> Bitcoin core developer and open source evangelist
> BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
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