Tamas Blummer [ARCHIVE] on Nostr: 📅 Original date posted:2014-03-14 📝 Original message:you miss the point ...
📅 Original date posted:2014-03-14
📝 Original message:you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about
the form of a price.
A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a
price in some currency.
A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price
but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.
Tamas Blummer
Bits of Proof
On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach <andreas at schildbach.de> wrote:
> How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?
>
> At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what
> people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC
> 0.003578.
>
> Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.
>
>
> On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
>> You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder
>> why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you
>> gave them are bad.
>>
>> I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a
>> currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies
>> do.
>>
>> 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits
>> would be.
>>
>>
>> Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof
>>
>> On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach <andreas at schildbach.de>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion
>>> because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and
>>> questions if exchange rates happen to differ by >10%.
>>>
>>> I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in
>>> local currency that matters to the users.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
>>>> Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for
>>>> µBTC.
>>>>
>>>> I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched
>>>> other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to
>>>> mBTC.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
>>>>> The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.
>>>>> It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread
>>>>> now.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe
>>>>> <g.rowe at froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive
>>>>> presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple
>>>>> configuration panel giving pretty much every possible
>>>>> combination: icon, m+icon, μ+icon, BTC, mBTC, μBTC, XBT,
>>>>> mXBT, μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing
>>>>> symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to
>>>>> customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit
>>>>> symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving
>>>>> icon+m etc).
>>>>>
>>>>> Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from
>>>>> the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it
>>>>> seems that μ+icon is more sensible.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let us know what you'd like.
>>>>>
>>>>> Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font
>>>>> Awesome icon:
>>>>> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI
>>>>> guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik at bitpay.com
>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Resurrecting this topic. Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC
>>>>> several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like
>>>>> the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will
>>>>> happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to
>>>>> yet another decimal place transition.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Nov 17, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Wendell <w at grabhive.com
>>>>> <mailto:w at grabhive.com>> wrote:
>>>>>> We're with uBTC too. Been waiting for the signal to do
>>>>>> this,
>>>>> let's do it right after the fee system is improved.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -wendell
>>>>>>
>>>>>> grabhive.com <http://grabhive.com>; |
>>>>>> twitter.com/hivewallet
>>>>> <http://twitter.com/hivewallet>; | gpg: 6C0C9411
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 15, 2013, at 6:03 AM, Jeff Garzik wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Go straight to uBTC. Humans and existing computer
>>>>>>> systems
>>>>> handle numbers to
>>>>>>> the left of the decimals just fine (HK Dollars, Yen).
>>>>>>> The
>>>>> opposite is
>>>>>>> untrue (QuickBooks really does not like 3+ decimal
>>>>>>> places).
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Jeff Garzik Bitcoin core developer and open source
>>>>> evangelist BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
>>>>> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph
>>>>> databases and their applications. Written by three acclaimed
>>>>> leaders in the field, this first edition is now available.
>>>>> Download your free book today!
>>>>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> <mailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases
>>>>> and their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in
>>>>> the field, this first edition is now available. Download your
>>>>> free book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> <mailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your
>>>>> free book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free
>>>> book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free
>>> book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
>> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases
>> and their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free book
>> today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ Bitcoin-development
>> mailing list Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their
> applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
> this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
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📝 Original message:you miss the point Andreas. It is not about the magnitude but about
the form of a price.
A number with no decimals or with two decimals is percieved as a
price in some currency.
A number with more than two decimals is just not percieved as a price
but as a geeky something that you rather convert to local currency.
Tamas Blummer
Bits of Proof
On 14.03.2014, at 15:49, Andreas Schildbach <andreas at schildbach.de> wrote:
> How much do you pay for an Espresso in your local currency?
>
> At least for the Euro and the Dollar, mBTC 3.56 is very close to what
> people would expect. Certainly more familiar than µBTC 3558 or BTC
> 0.003578.
>
> Anyway, I was just sharing real-world experience: nobody is confused.
>
>
> On 03/14/2014 03:14 PM, Tamas Blummer wrote:
>> You give them a hard to interpret thing like mBTC and then wonder
>> why they rather look at local currency. Because the choices you
>> gave them are bad.
>>
>> I think Bitcoin would have a better chance to be percieved as a
>> currency of its own if it had prices and fractions like currencies
>> do.
>>
>> 3.558 mBTC or 0.003578 BTC will never be as accepted as 3558 bits
>> would be.
>>
>>
>> Tamas Blummer Bits of Proof
>>
>> On 14.03.2014, at 15:05, Andreas Schildbach <andreas at schildbach.de>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> btw. None of Bitcoin Wallet's users complained about confusion
>>> because of the mBTC switch. In contrast, I get many mails and
>>> questions if exchange rates happen to differ by >10%.
>>>
>>> I suspect nobody looks at the Bitcoin price. It's the amount in
>>> local currency that matters to the users.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 03/13/2014 02:40 PM, Andreas Schildbach wrote:
>>>> Indeed. And users were crying for mBTC. Nobody was asking for
>>>> µBTC.
>>>>
>>>> I must admit I was not aware if this thread. I just watched
>>>> other wallets and at some point decided its time to switch to
>>>> mBTC.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 03/13/2014 02:31 PM, Mike Hearn wrote:
>>>>> The standard has become mBTC and that's what was adopted.
>>>>> It's too late to try and sway this on a mailing list thread
>>>>> now.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Gary Rowe
>>>>> <g.rowe at froot.co.uk <mailto:g.rowe at froot.co.uk>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The MultiBit HD view is that this is a locale-sensitive
>>>>> presentation issue. As a result we offer a simple
>>>>> configuration panel giving pretty much every possible
>>>>> combination: icon, m+icon, μ+icon, BTC, mBTC, μBTC, XBT,
>>>>> mXBT, μXBT, sat along with settings for leading/trailing
>>>>> symbol, commas, spaces and points. This allows anyone to
>>>>> customise to meet their own needs beyond the offered default.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We apply the NIST guidelines for representation of SI unit
>>>>> symbols (i.e no conversion to native language, no RTL giving
>>>>> icon+m etc).
>>>>>
>>>>> Right now MultiBit HD is configured to use m+icon taken from
>>>>> the Font Awesome icon set. However reading earlier posts it
>>>>> seems that μ+icon is more sensible.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let us know what you'd like.
>>>>>
>>>>> Links: m+icon screenshot: http://imgur.com/a/WCDoG Font
>>>>> Awesome icon:
>>>>> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/btc/ NIST SI
>>>>> guidelines: http://physics.nist.gov/Pubs/SP811/sec07.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 13 March 2014 12:56, Jeff Garzik <jgarzik at bitpay.com
>>>>> <mailto:jgarzik at bitpay.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Resurrecting this topic. Bitcoin Wallet moved to mBTC
>>>>> several weeks ago, which was disappointing -- it sounded like
>>>>> the consensus was uBTC, and moving to uBTC later --which will
>>>>> happen-- may result in additional user confusion, thanks to
>>>>> yet another decimal place transition.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Nov 17, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Wendell <w at grabhive.com
>>>>> <mailto:w at grabhive.com>> wrote:
>>>>>> We're with uBTC too. Been waiting for the signal to do
>>>>>> this,
>>>>> let's do it right after the fee system is improved.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -wendell
>>>>>>
>>>>>> grabhive.com <http://grabhive.com>; |
>>>>>> twitter.com/hivewallet
>>>>> <http://twitter.com/hivewallet>; | gpg: 6C0C9411
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 15, 2013, at 6:03 AM, Jeff Garzik wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Go straight to uBTC. Humans and existing computer
>>>>>>> systems
>>>>> handle numbers to
>>>>>>> the left of the decimals just fine (HK Dollars, Yen).
>>>>>>> The
>>>>> opposite is
>>>>>>> untrue (QuickBooks really does not like 3+ decimal
>>>>>>> places).
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -- Jeff Garzik Bitcoin core developer and open source
>>>>> evangelist BitPay, Inc. https://bitpay.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
>>>>> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph
>>>>> databases and their applications. Written by three acclaimed
>>>>> leaders in the field, this first edition is now available.
>>>>> Download your free book today!
>>>>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> <mailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases
>>>>> and their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in
>>>>> the field, this first edition is now available. Download your
>>>>> free book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> <mailto:Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net>
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your
>>>>> free book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free
>>>> book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book "Graph
>>> Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and
>>> their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free
>>> book today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Bitcoin-development mailing list
>>> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
>> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases
>> and their applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the
>> field, this first edition is now available. Download your free book
>> today! http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ Bitcoin-development
>> mailing list Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn Graph Databases - Download FREE O'Reilly Book
> "Graph Databases" is the definitive new guide to graph databases and their
> applications. Written by three acclaimed leaders in the field,
> this first edition is now available. Download your free book today!
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/13534_NeoTech
> _______________________________________________
> Bitcoin-development mailing list
> Bitcoin-development at lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development
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